[Yr7-10it] Scratch, Gamemaker, VB.net, Python, PHP and MySQL - Programming for all levels

[Bill Kerr]

Hi Kent,

> Its now that time when subject selection is being made. My gut feeling is
that since I dont 'pander' to the kids (ie be their best buddy or let them
play games all the time!), they decide to put IT down low on their list of
choices. Hey, its their loss I say.


I think there's a big background debate going on all the time in education
these days. In one corner - back to basics. In the other corner, some sort
of "discovery learning" and yes, I agree with you that often the latter is
ineffectual (but not always)

Your approach is authentic, no doubt about it. The kids know that you are
offering something that contains rigour.

My approach has included the idea of tapping into things that motivate kids
- to make some sort of connection between game playing (fun) and game making
(rigour). But I ended up rejecting slogans like "Have fun while you learn"
as far too sugary

I thought that might keep up the enrollments in IT but what I have found is
that it didn't. At senior school level there are other considerations that
students take more into account than "fun" -

   - what job
   - what career pathways
   - can I do it? (not too hard)

But I still think that Seymour Papert's initial big idea was correct - how
can we use computers to teach powerful ideas to children. I like the way
alan kay recently put it:

"One thing that seems to be almost universal around the world, is that the
notion of children learning some subject (like mathematics) is almost always
posed as "how can children be taught the adult version of this subject?",
rather than, as Montessori, Piaget, Bruner and Papert have shown "how can we
find an honest children's version of this subject?"

IMO thats how we should be using computers in school

- Bill



On 9/17/07, Kent Beveridge <kbeveridge at stbc.vic.edu.au> wrote:
>
> Hi Kevork, I kinda agree with you in terms of the approach to learning the
> topic of computer programming. I, perhaps unlike yourself, didnt come from a
> pure programming trained background, my training was more focussed on being
> the 'middleman' in industry between the programmers and the management,
> kinda like the 'interpreter' I guess. You do however, have a reasonably
> valid point about the learning of languages these days. Personally, I think
> the kids have me a 'gimme now or else' approach. In some ways, the courses
> developed have 'catered' for that approach, and that has I feel, led to
> perhaps some of the lacking in the IT industry relative to what is being
> 'churned out' by education institutions now. Dont misunderstand please, they
> are just bound by what the powers that be TELL them to teach, rather than
> what the market actually NEEDS.
> Short courses and instant qualifications seem to be the go! (if you can
> afford the 10 grand or so..)
> Sorry, I'm a bit of a traditionalist and this attitude of teens who just
> want the internet and game playing, gets up my nose.
> Pity bout the small businesses out there who try to get a new staffer who
> can type, add and subtract efficiently and correctly, has the ability to
> pick up a basic system of filing and can maybe use the office computer to
> enter data. Its a bonus if they can 'follow instructions', pay attention for
> more than 10 minutes, and stay employed for more than 3 months!  Dont even
> think about asking them to make you a coffee!!
> This is not fantasy, before some of you jump up and down, this is actually
> FACT!
> And NO, this is not an IR bashing exercise either. (that topic is
> irrelevent!)




Its now that time when subject selection is being made. My gut feeling is
> that since I dont 'pander' to the kids (ie be their best buddy or let them
> play games all the time!), they decide to put IT down low on their list of
> choices. Hey, its their loss I say. The IT industry has lots of
> opportunities if future staff are just prepared to do a little training and
> just hang in there. They dont just want someone who is able to play
> adventure games all day or playstation!
>
> Before some of you start to call me a 'dinosaur', I'm all for
> multi-skilling our kids, in fact I actively encourage it. I enjoy the IT
> classroom but it still annoys me that games seem to be the central focus of
> attention to many.
>
> Sorry, got carried away....
> KB.
>
> Kent Beveridge,
> I.T. co-ordinator
> St. Brigids Catholic Sec. College
> Horsham
> email.. kbeveridge at stbc.vic.edu.au
>
> |<3|\|7  b3\/3r1D93 ?  ;-)
>
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