[Year 12 IT Apps] Unit 2 Outcome 3.

Tue Sep 7 10:01:39 EST 2010

I am VERY fortunate to have a web design competition run by our Learning
area Network. Telstra and Monash Uni are the primary sponsors. They find
business for us to us. Its run in term 2 so I switch Unit 1 and 2.

Cheers

Warrick Mann

Traralgon College

From: itapps-bounces at edulists.com.au
[mailto:itapps-bounces at edulists.com.au] On Behalf Of Mark KELLY
Sent: Tuesday, 7 September 2010 9:20 AM
To: Year 12 IT Applications Teachers' Mailing List
Subject: Re: [Year 12 IT Apps] Unit 2 Outcome 3.

I tend to start the outcome quite early, often when starting U2O2.
Since there's little class time needed at the start, they can find lots
of opportunities to meet their client.  When the outcome starts
'officially' after U2O2 they get class time to properly start producing
the product (usually a website - I'd hate to inflict my kids'
programming skills on a real client, unless the client really needed an
application wherein a pig wiggled its ears...)

I like the outcome: it's an interesting change for the kids to go on
unsupervised excursions and feel the pressure of actually getting their
work go live and be accountable for it.  It's good to see the outcome
return in the new study design.

On 6 September 2010 23:56, George Ciotti
<ciotti.george.w at edumail.vic.gov.au> wrote:

You mean real "hypothetical" client? Like you mean real "prototype"
website? Obviously you have to do what is realistically possible within
the demands of the SAC and the conditions you find yourself in within a
school. I have chosen the school canteen as the client this year. Yet it
does present problems similar to the Virtual Teams SAC in ITA.
It would be a lot easier to access a "real client" if there was more
time to prepare for and complete the SAC. Given that one is competing
with numerous other curricular and extra curricular activities that pull
students in and out of classes on a consistent basis, it is a juggling
act. For a collaboratively based activity it can be a minefield. At
least that is my experience so far. Eight to 10 periods does not a
comfortable environment make. Hence, real clients can become
simulated/hypothetical clients. And in reality what is wrong with that
approach? Doesn't it happen most of the time in schools? I think one has
to be careful in suggesting that real learning only takes place by
solving authentic problems and attaching these authentic problems to
real, living breathing "normal?" people. Learning can, and does, take
place in a variety of settings. Solving authentic (or non-authentic -
what is the difference in this context?) problems within a simulated
environment, I would argue, can be just as valid and in some cases even
more so given the control you have over the learning environment. The
notion of authenticity is also arguable here because the "real" client
is doing the student a favour and this is well known by the student from
the outset. In real life, with real clients the timelines for solving
problems are much longer than what we could ever hope to give our
students. I agree that it should be within the spirit, as this allows
for a variety of approaches.

Cheers
George

On 9/6/10 8:30 PM, "Christophersen, Paula P"
<christophersen.paula.p at edumail.vic.gov.au> wrote:

	I would like to support Mark's comments. The requirement is that
it is a real client, and this is very important, as solving authentic
problems supports real learning. While not preferable, the client can be
a person from the school, but it should not be you, the teacher. 

	Regards
	Paula

________________________________

	From: itapps-bounces at edulists.com.au on behalf of Mark KELLY
	Sent: Mon 6/09/2010 8:23 AM
	To: Year 12 IT Applications Teachers' Mailing List
	Subject: Re: [Year 12 IT Apps] Unit 2 Outcome 3.

	The spirit is that it is a real outside person.  In desperation,
I have used teachers as clients in the past, but it's still very much an
insulated environment with supportive and comfortable people being your
boss.  They need to learn with normal people, not teachers  ;-)

	I tell them early in the year to start finding clients - the
shock of dealing with people in the real-world is a valuable experience.

	On 2 September 2010 19:24, Robert Koren
<robert.koren at overnewton.vic.edu.au> wrote:

	Folks,

	Trying to get my head around some of the new study design for IT
and I wanted to know how to interpret "client" in Unit 2 Outcome 3.  Can
I as a teacher simulate a client with my students issued a case study to
complete for their projects or do I have to go out and find clients that
my students report to?

	When I read it I feel I am supposed to have a real world example
and I am going to find it hard to find projects with real world clients.

	Your thoughts??

	Regards,

	Robert Koren 
	Head of Pasteur House
	Head of IT Faculty 9 - 12
	Overnewton Anglican Community College
	Telephone: (03) 9334 0031
	Email: robert.koren at overnewton.vic.edu.au

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