[Year 12 IT Apps] a formatting "comment"..Kent

Laurie Savage sav at pvgc.vic.edu.au
Tue Aug 11 12:52:25 EST 2009 

Filemaker has been around so long that its conventions should probably be
respected by the examiners. Although (and I'm just thinking out loud here)
is it really a RDBMS? To what extent does it follow the Codd model? Even
though application development is fast & simple, normalisation and keys were
handled strangely by FM - I'm not sure, but would it be standard practice to
have an FM sheet that looked like ::StudentID::TaskID::Grade:: ? I haven't
developed with FMPro since version 4 so I might be talking through my ****.

Laurie 

-----Original Message-----
From: itapps-bounces at edulists.com.au [mailto:itapps-bounces at edulists.com.au]
On Behalf Of Mark Kelly
Sent: Tuesday, 11 August 2009 11:09 AM
To: Year 12 IT Applications Teachers' Mailing List
Subject: Re: [Year 12 IT Apps] a formatting "comment"..Kent

You could well be right there, Laurie.  They are terms not familiar to
Filemaker users, however.

I train my kids to translate Access terms to and from Filemaker
nomenclature, just to be safe.

Laurie Savage wrote:
> I think the terms Query and Report are generic and predate Access by 
> several years. Before Access came along Dbase and Paradox were using 
> this terminology back in the days of DOS, Crystal Reports (Windows) 
> was querying databases to format reports, and SQL (Structured Query 
> Language) has been with us a long time.
> 
> Laurie Savage
> PVGC
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: itapps-bounces at edulists.com.au 
> [mailto:itapps-bounces at edulists.com.au]
> On Behalf Of Mark Kelly
> Sent: Sunday, 9 August 2009 2:12 PM
> To: Year 12 IT Applications Teachers' Mailing List
> Subject: Re: [Year 12 IT Apps] a formatting "comment"..Kent
> 
> VCAA cannot prescribe software used in outcomes.  If they DO decide to 
> do so, they must publish the prescribed software as they do with 
> Software Development's approved programming languages.
> 
> They MUST accept any answer that is correct for ANY available software
> product: spreadsheet, DBMS, web editor etc.
> 
> They MUST NOT ask questions that are specific to any one of the 
> available varieties of software products (e.g. Access, Excel), 
> including the esoteric terminology used by them.
> 
> They'd better not ask another Access-specific question this year.  The 
> very mention of "queries" or "reports" is too brand-specific.  It 
> seriously disadvantages Filemaker Pro users, for example.
> 
> It worries me how they assume a particular family or brand of software 
> is "standard" and merrily ask questions assuming that EVERYONE uses 
> that family or brand.
> 
> It's wrong and must stop.
> 
> I feel better now.
> 
> Kent Beveridge wrote:
>> If I may, an observation...
>> Personally, I am a "majority Microsoft" product user, not by desire 
>> but
> just essentially as that is what my employers (the various schools of 
> my teaching time..) have had available to use for my I.T. classroom
ramblings.
>> Surely the VCAA can be flexible enough to allow the examiners to mark 
>> as
> 'correct' the essentials of formulae presented to them by students. 
> What I mean is, what if the students have NEVER used Microsoft or APPLE
products?
> Surely they shouldnt be penalised when in fact their solution would 
> work on their "flavor" of application software (eg open source 
> spreadsheet or other market available alternative).
>> If we are to produce flexible and thinking students for employers 
>> then we
> must allow them to provide solutions appropriate to their working 
> environments.
>> Case in point: Applications developers in the commercial workforce 
>> may use
> a program that is nothing like Microsoft and yet will do the same job 
> most efficiently on the mainframe in the workplace. I ask you 
> VCAA...how many schools out there have a mainframe costing millions of 
> bucks that runs the exact same formats and conventions of Microsoft on all
their applications?
> Lets get real here with our exam expectations on the students and 
> allow them some flexibility with their answers!
>>  
>>  
>> Kent.
>>  
>> Kent Beveridge,
>> St. Brigids CSC, Horsham.
>> Ph (03) 5382 3545
>> http://www.stbc.vic.edu.au/
>> kbeveridge at stbc.vic.edu.au
>> "This email and any attachments may be confidential.  You must not
> disclose or use the information in this email if you are not the 
> intended recipient.  If you have received this email in error, please 
> notify us immediately and delete the email and all copies.  The School 
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> whether caused by the negligence of the sender or not.  The content 
> and opinions in this email are not necessarily those of the School."
>> ________________________________
>>
>> From: itapps-bounces at edulists.com.au on behalf of Roland Gesthuizen
>> Sent: Sat 8/8/2009 2:02 PM
>> To: Year 12 IT Applications Teachers' Mailing List
>> Subject: Re: [Year 12 IT Apps] Examination reports
>>
>>
>>
>> Yes, it isnt so much as they came up with something different or that 
>> they have invented a new standard. There is an open standards group 
>> that is trying to improve the exchange of recalculated formulas in 
>> spreadsheets and I suspect that is what they have used. Google Docs 
>> uses this format too. Let me check. Yep .. works with double quotes.
>>
>> Curious I did not directly spot this before as I jump across between 
>> XLS, ODC and GoogleDocs. Shows how plastic our minds are to these 
>> subtle changes. I guess when it flags an error, I just thump my 
>> forehead to shake a neuron loose and amend the formula with either 
>> single or double quotes. REM hmmm
>>
>> Regards Roland
>>
>> 2009/8/7 Robert <robert at yinnar.com>:
>>> And I have just checked Open Office. Different again.
>>>
>>> Requires semicolons rather than commas as separators between items, 
>>> eg
>>>
>>> =IF(C2>40;"yes";"no")
>>>
>>> ?
>>>
>>>
>>> Robert Hind (Semi-retired)
>>> Ashwood and Traralgon
>>> robert at yinnar.com
>>>
>>>
>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Robert" <robert at yinnar.com>
>>> To: <itapps at edulists.com.au>
>>> Sent: Friday, August 07, 2009 3:50 PM
>>> Subject: Fw: [Year 12 IT Apps] Examination reports
>>>
>>>
>>>> Whoops! I missed out one (double straight) quote :-)
>>>>
>>>> Should have read:
>>>>
>>>> And can I add to Mark's message by noting that Excel does not like 
>>>> "smart quotes", or curly quotes but only straight quotes, ie
>>>>
>>>> =IF(C2>40,"YES"," ")
>>>>
>>>> Robert Hind (Semi-retired)
>>>> Ashwood and Traralgon
>>>> robert at yinnar.com
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Robert" <robert at yinnar.com>
>>>> To: "Year 12 IT Applications Teachers' Mailing List"
>>>> <itapps at edulists.com.au>
>>>> Sent: Friday, August 07, 2009 3:33 PM
>>>> Subject: Re: [Year 12 IT Apps] Examination reports
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> And can I add to Mark's message by noting that Excel does not like 
>>>>> "smart quotes", or curly quotes but only straight quotes, ie
>>>>>
>>>>> =IF(C2>40,"YES," ")
>>>>>
>>>>> Pedantic? Yes! But Excel, and other apps, will only accept exactly 
>>>>> what they have been programmed to expect.
>>>>>
>>>>> Robert Hind (Semi-retired)
>>>>> Ashwood and Traralgon
>>>>> robert at yinnar.com
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mark Kelly"
>>>>> <kel at mckinnonsc.vic.edu.au>
>>>>> To: "Year 12 IT Applications Teachers' Mailing List"
>>>>> <itapps at edulists.com.au>
>>>>> Sent: Friday, August 07, 2009 1:26 PM
>>>>> Subject: Re: [Year 12 IT Apps] Examination reports
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> Examiners' report, ITA Q12b:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Quote
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Few students could correctly write the formula for the IF 
>>>>>> statement =IF(C2>40, 'YES',' ').
>>>>>>
>>>>>> End Quote
>>>>>>
>>>>>> And fewer examiners could either, apparently:  double quotes 
>>>>>> rather than single quotes are needed (at least in Excel, which is 
>>>>>> the undeclared standard for all spreadsheet questions in the exam).
>>>>>>
>>>>>> It does bug me when a commentary on what is correct and what is 
>>>>>> not gets it wrong.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Christophersen, Paula P wrote:
>>>>>>> Dear colleagues
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>  In case you are not aware, the examination reports for the 2008 
>>>>>>> exams in IT apps and Software development are available at the 
>>>>>>> following addresses.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> http://www.vcaa.vic.edu.au/vce/studies/infotech/it-applications/
>>>>>>> e
>>>>>>> xams.ht
>>>>>>> ml#H2N10037
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> http://www.vcaa.vic.edu.au/vce/studies/infotech/softwaredevel/ex
>>>>>>> a
>>>>>>> ms.html
>>>>>>> #H2N10037
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>  Regards
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Paula
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>  Paula Christophersen
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> ICT Curriculum Manager
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> VCAA
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> 41 St Andrews Place
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> EAST MELBOURNE 3002
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> (03) 9651 4378
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>  Important - This email and any attachments may be confidential. 
>>>>>>> If received in error, please contact us and delete all copies. 
>>>>>>> Before opening or using attachments check them for viruses and 
>>>>>>> defects. Regardless of any loss, damage or consequence, whether 
>>>>>>> caused by the negligence of the sender or not, resulting 
>>>>>>> directly or indirectly from the use of any attached files our 
>>>>>>> liability is limited to resupplying any affected attachments. 
>>>>>>> Any representations or opinions expressed are those of the 
>>>>>>> individual sender, and not necessarily those of the Department 
>>>>>>> of Education and
> Early Childhood Development.
>>>>>> --
>>>>>> Mark Kelly
>>>>>> Manager - Information Systems
>>>>>> McKinnon Secondary College
>>>>>> kel AT mckinnonsc.vic.edu.au
>>>>>> McKinnon Rd, McKinnon 3204, Victoria, Australia Direct line /
>>>>>> Voicemail: 8520 9085 Fax +613 9578 9253
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Webmaster - http://www.mckinnonsc.vic.edu.au 
>>>>>> <http://www.mckinnonsc.vic.edu.au/>
>>>>>> IT Lecture notes: http://vceit.com <http://vceit.com/>
>>>>>> Moderator: IT Applications Mailing List
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Why do people mis-spell 'grammar' and mispronounce 'pronuniciation'?
>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>> http://www.edulists.com.au <http://www.edulists.com.au/>  - FAQ, 
>>>>>> resources, subscribe, unsubscribe IT Applications Mailing List 
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>>>>>> http://www.vcaa.vic.edu.au/vce/studies/infotech/itapplications3-4
>>>>>> .html
> - Victorian Curriculum and Assessment Authority and
>>>>>> http://www.vitta.org.au <http://www.vitta.org.au/>   - VITTA
Victorian
> Information Technology
>>>>>> Teachers Association Inc
>>>>>>
>>>>> _______________________________________________
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>>>>> resources, subscribe, unsubscribe IT Applications Mailing List 
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>>>>> html
> - Victorian Curriculum and Assessment Authority and
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> Information Technology
>>>>> Teachers Association Inc
>>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> http://www.edulists.com.au <http://www.edulists.com.au/>  - FAQ, 
>>>> resources, subscribe, unsubscribe IT Applications Mailing List 
>>>> kindly supported by 
>>>> http://www.vcaa.vic.edu.au/vce/studies/infotech/itapplications3-4.h
>>>> tml -
> Victorian Curriculum and Assessment Authority and
>>>> http://www.vitta.org.au <http://www.vitta.org.au/>   - VITTA Victorian
> Information Technology Teachers
>>>> Association Inc
>>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> http://www.edulists.com.au <http://www.edulists.com.au/>  - FAQ, 
>>> resources, subscribe, unsubscribe IT Applications Mailing List 
>>> kindly supported by 
>>> http://www.vcaa.vic.edu.au/vce/studies/infotech/itapplications3-4.ht
>>> ml -
> Victorian Curriculum and Assessment Authority and
>>> http://www.vitta.org.au <http://www.vitta.org.au/>   - VITTA Victorian
> Information Technology Teachers
>>> Association Inc
>>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Roland Gesthuizen - ICT Coordinator - Westall Secondary College 
>> http://www.westallsc.vic.edu.au <http://www.westallsc.vic.edu.au/>
>>
>> "Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful, committed citizens can 
>> change the world; indeed it is the only thing that ever has."
>> --Margaret Mead
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> http://www.edulists.com.au <http://www.edulists.com.au/>  - FAQ, 
>> resources, subscribe, unsubscribe IT Applications Mailing List kindly 
>> supported by
> http://www.vcaa.vic.edu.au/vce/studies/infotech/itapplications3-4.html 
> - Victorian Curriculum and Assessment Authority and
>> http://www.vitta.org.au <http://www.vitta.org.au/>   - VITTA Victorian
> Information Technology Teachers Association Inc
>>
>>
>>
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>> l
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>> http://www.vitta.org.au  - VITTA Victorian Information Technology 
>> Teachers Association Inc
> 
> --
> Mark Kelly
> Manager - Information Systems
> McKinnon Secondary College
> McKinnon Rd McKinnon 3204, Victoria, Australia Direct line: 8520 9085 
> School Phone +613 8520 9000
> School Fax   +613 9578 9253
> kel AT mckinnonsc.vic.edu.au
> 
> Webmaster - http://www.mckinnonsc.vic.edu.au IT Lecture notes:
> http://vceit.com
> Moderator: ITA Mailing List
> 
> Some days you're the pigeon.  Some days you're the statue.
> 
> _______________________________________________
> http://www.edulists.com.au - FAQ, resources, subscribe, unsubscribe IT 
> Applications Mailing List kindly supported by 
> http://www.vcaa.vic.edu.au/vce/studies/infotech/itapplications3-4.html 
> - Victorian Curriculum and Assessment Authority and 
> http://www.vitta.org.au  - VITTA Victorian Information Technology 
> Teachers Association Inc
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> http://www.edulists.com.au - FAQ, resources, subscribe, unsubscribe IT 
> Applications Mailing List kindly supported by 
> http://www.vcaa.vic.edu.au/vce/studies/infotech/itapplications3-4.html 
> - Victorian Curriculum and Assessment Authority and 
> http://www.vitta.org.au  - VITTA Victorian Information Technology 
> Teachers Association Inc
> 
> 
> 


--
Mark Kelly
Manager - Information Systems
McKinnon Secondary College
McKinnon Rd McKinnon 3204, Victoria, Australia Direct line / Voicemail: 8520
9085 School Phone +613 8520 9000 School Fax +613 9578 9253
kel at mckinnonsc.vic.edu.au

Webmaster - http://www.mckinnonsc.vic.edu.au IT Lecture notes:
http://vceit.com
Moderator: IT Applications Mailing List

RealMenDon'tNeedSpacebars.

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