[Year 12 IT Apps] What Future IT?

[Charmaine Taylor]

But those soft option subjects don't help ENTER scores. Bus. Man is 
downgraded heaps ie up to 10 points one year I was involved with it 
whereas IT is penalised by only 2. And those kids who score >40 or is it 
45 are not penalised at all.
Charmaine Taylor
Sunbury Downs College

Cameron Bell wrote:

> Charmaine said: "Also, another comment made on this list was that a 
> problem with IT is that it is not a prerequisite for uni courses but 
> that doesn't explain the popularity of Business Management or 
> Psychology."
>
> It does if you read it in the context about maximising ENTER scores. 
> Those two subjects are seen as soft options (this is not my opinion, 
> but based on student feedback) that will help students maximise their 
> score. In the past, many think they have a better chance at getting a 
> higher score by taking them rather than Specialist Maths, Physics or IT.
> This is not a problem /with/ IT, it is a problem /for/ IT.
>
> Cameron
>
>
> Charmaine Taylor wrote:
>
>> I agree with you Bill that real world applications should be the 
>> basis of our teaching in IT and those you mentioned are indeed in the 
>> real world including the spreadsheets, databases, and web design. It 
>> is tempting to look at IT from the point of view of the applications 
>> (ie I have to teach spreadsheets, what shall I do?) rather than from 
>> the point of view of the problem to be solved (eg a cow at the 
>> abattoir has a disease. How do we find all others exposed to that 
>> disease and cull them? The ear tagging network! How does that work? 
>> Well, let's talk about databases and networks.....), If we take a 
>> problem-based learning approach, the subject of IT becomes inherently 
>> interesting and much more than spreadsheets, databases, etc.
>>
>> Also, I am reviewing our IT units 1 and 2 and am considering some 
>> changes that people might like to comment on.
>> Unit 1 Outcome 3 I have a disc titled /My Virtual Home/, a CAD 
>> application in 3D. Thought I'd set a scenario in an architect's 
>> office. Kids interview(learning data gathering/survey skills) a 
>> parent/friend re renovating their loungeroom or build a home, then 
>> design it with the software app.This is a beaut use of visualising 
>> thinking!  I'll identify the stakeholders (business owner, student as 
>> the architect, customer) and set students the task of investigating 
>> and reporting on one of the privacy, ownership or ethical issues from 
>> each stakeholder's point of view.
>> Before anyone says this will take too long, the only software 
>> requirement for the assessment task is online software - Powerpoint 
>> or Word will do - kids know these already. The work in this outcome 
>> is in the research and after a couple of seminars much of the 
>> research can be done as homework. I reckon this task could be fun as 
>> well as realistic.
>> Unit 2 Outcome 1 I am not sure where to set this yet but Bill has 
>> given me a couple of ideas (eg maybe a factory production line or 
>> automated forklift in the warehouse) and doing robotics using Lego 
>> programming software. And its another good example of visualising 
>> thinking. I've also been tossing around the idea of programming 
>> simulations of systems such as water cycle, circulatory, hydraulic 
>> brakes but just realised these might fit better in Unit 1 outcome 1.
>> There must be many other possibilities out there. Let's share them.
>>
>> BTW there was an interesting article in last Saturday's The Age about 
>> how some companies have replaced email with wikis for their internal 
>> and team communications. (The Age, Features p.16 /When the inbox is 
>> on the outer/)
>> Another aside, my students are over games by the time they get to VCE 
>> - they want serious apps that give them an idea of the type of work 
>> available to them in an IT career. I sell IT by telling them that 
>> there is a huge range of pathways in IT and VCE IT will help them 
>> decide which course they should apply for.
>> Also, another comment made on this list was that a problem with IT is 
>> that it is not a prerequisite for uni courses but that doesn't 
>> explain the popularity of Business Management or Psychology.
>>
>> Charmaine Taylor
>> Sunbury Downs College
>> Kent Beveridge wrote:
>>
>>> Hey Bill, you make some very valid points. Additionally, now that I 
>>> doing this extra maths study, I can actually understand what you 
>>> mean(bonus for me) in terms of the apps mentioned. Can I also add 
>>> that as part of my document presented to my principal to be 
>>> considered for design ideas for applying to the new computing 
>>> facilities to be built next year, I suggested adding robotics eg CAD 
>>> design linked to a multi-axis robot or 'simply' perhaps a milling 
>>> machine or similar that could be programmed. My thought was to give 
>>> the kids the opportunity to SEE in action what their programs were 
>>> doing. I remember getting excited when I designed first in CAD 
>>> (using CADDSMAN, then later, AUTOCAD). I understand that this is 
>>> only one potential use but its a start to regenerate an interest and 
>>> can be extended. Personally, I got no feedback from the boss so have 
>>> no idea if it even got to first base. Methinks they just chose the 
>>> boring old route of a couple of projectors, a fancy electronic 
>>> whiteboard and some brand new boxes...BORING +++. Its this type of 
>>> thinking thats killing off the subject I reckon!
>>> Give the kids something they can see happening (physical) rather 
>>> than just program an interface(GUI) to do stuff!
>>> Sorry, my industry days are surfacing again!
>>> hmmm...links to packaging industry, building, cranes, operations 
>>> management, aircraft design....got carried away again with REAL 
>>> applications of computers (real world)
>>> ...oh yeah, spreadsheets, wordprocessing, database, 
>>> webdesign.zzzzz..snore,snore...(BOS world!)
>>>  
>>> Sometimes wonder why they bother to ask for input from teachers when 
>>> most of it is ignored anyway. I think our techie here is just 
>>> getting new boxes etc as above and thinking that if they can paint 
>>> the cat another color they can call it a Tiger. HA!  Give it real 
>>> claws and make it growl and scare little children(and adults too!) - 
>>> then call it a Tiger!!
>>> KB.
>>>  
>>> Kent Beveridge,
>>> I.T. co-ordinator
>>> St. Brigids Catholic Sec. College
>>> Horsham
>>> email.. kbeveridge at stbc.vic.edu.au
>>>  
>>> |<3|\|7  b3\/3r1D93 ?  ;-)
>>>
>>> Wishes and Eggs, one you make and one you break!  A bit like 
>>> promises.....
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>>> ________________________________
>>>
>>> From: itapps-bounces at edulists.com.au on behalf of Bill Kerr
>>> Sent: Wed 9/26/2007 5:13 PM
>>> To: Year 12 IT Applications Teachers' Mailing List
>>> Subject: Re: [Year 12 IT Apps] What Future IT?
>>>
>>>
>>> hi kevork,
>>>
>>> appreciate the effort you have gone to with your comprehensive list 
>>> and analysis
>>>
>>> I went through your list and think it can be abbreviated to three 
>>> main things:
>>>
>>>
>>> 1.    tertiary admission (IT deemed to be less important than other 
>>> subjects)
>>> 2.    employment issues (gone to india, false perception or boring 
>>> jobs) 3.    trivial or boring or irrelevant or integrated from 
>>> either student or school perspective either due to school policies 
>>> (not compulsory, integration) or lack of teacher skill
>>>
>>> I've taken out the "fun" item because at the moment that's just 
>>> being suggested as a possible solution to the problem I think (ie. 
>>> introduce game maker to senior school), it's not there yet in 
>>> Victoria - don't think it will solve the problems anyway based on my 
>>> own experience in one school in SA
>>> Teachers don't have much control over items (1) and (2). We might 
>>> argue with the Uni stakeholders but they have more say. We might 
>>> argue that there really are good jobs out there but for some reason 
>>> its not getting through. By focusing on (1) and (2) there might be 
>>> some impact on the rate of decline but it's not going to stop the 
>>> decline. Vocational pathways will continue to be offered in senior 
>>> school irregardless. It's important but I see it as a side issue to 
>>> the more important educational issues
>>> Item 3 is a can of worms partly because as a society we haven't yet 
>>> worked out what computers are really good for. It's an all purpose 
>>> machine that can emulate lots of other machines but what are they 
>>> really good for?
>>> eg. the printing press was invented in 1450 but it took a generation 
>>> before new forms of printing became popular - the older generation 
>>> had to die out. eg. the first scientific illustrations didn't appear 
>>> in books until 1484 
>>> http://billkerr2.blogspot.com/2007/06/what-did-printing-press-change-and-how.html 
>>>
>>>
>>> I would argue that there are unique and powerful educational 
>>> purposes for computers - eg. dynamically representing the 
>>> exponential spread of an epidemic, teaching calculus through vectors
>>> I seem to be coming to a position that stand-alone IT might have 
>>> limited impact in education. But nevertheless, the computer still is 
>>> a vitally important, amazing and powerful machine that all learners 
>>> ought to be invited to explore more deeply - for its powerful 
>>> functionality, not just game playing, web surfing or the latest 
>>> application
>>> It's more like this - the printing press led to the book which led 
>>> to literature which led to English literature
>>> - the computer allows for the dynamic representation of systems 
>>> which leads to what new subjects (?) or what extensions of existing 
>>> subjects such as physics etc.?
>>> I think mark guzdial is on the right path here: start with a rich 
>>> concept from the wider world of science or economics, for example, 
>>> and then use computers, including programming, to enrich the study 
>>> of that domain
>>> http://billkerr2.blogspot.com/2007/08/mark-guzdial-on-computing-education.html 
>>>
>>>
>>> I see this sort of approach as more productive and more hopeful in 
>>> the longer term
>>> cheers,
>>>   
>>
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