[elearning] Query on iPad research [Scanned] [Spam score:8%]

Thu Sep 6 14:46:30 EST 2012

Fantastic conversation..
And along the lines we have been developing as well...
We are looking at iPads for the junior levels, and my techs are nutting out some processes for BYOD... for the senior levels, initially
They have got the scripting stuff sorted for Macs, PCs, iPads/iPods looking at setting up an isolated wireless spot where the students will be able to log in and allow certificates to be added to their devices
but as yet have not found a simple way to allow android devices, and have not yet looked at windows phones.
Any thoughts?
Cheers
Suz

From: elearning-bounces at edulists.com.au [mailto:elearning-bounces at edulists.com.au] On Behalf Of Roland Gesthuizen
Sent: Thursday, 6 September 2012 9:40 AM
To: elearning Teachers' Mailing List
Subject: Re: [elearning] Query on iPad research [Scanned] [Spam score:8%]

I am now inclined to think the same Tim. That we adopt iPads for 7-10 then branch out to a BYOD type program for senior students.

I suspect we can expect cheaper devices to flow from both Apple and Android as we seem to have reached a point where we cannot do hugely more with screen resolution, big battery life and cloud connectivity. My guess is that we now need to watch the AppStore and integration with other devices as I notice happening now to my phone and desktop with my iPad. Good news for educators is that good apps are becoming cross platform .. albet slowly.

I am curious where the cheaper iPad-mini will slot into the education landscape. Will this be the 1:1 tool that many primary schools have been holding out for?

Regards Roland

On 6 September 2012 09:20, Timothy Kitchen <TKitchen at strathcona.vic.edu.au<mailto:TKitchen at strathcona.vic.edu.au>> wrote:
Hi again folks,

Personally, I am leaning towards iPads as the main 1:1 device up to Year 11 but then give students the choice (including the use of smart phones, Andriod Tablets, Windows or Apple laptops) for Year 11 & 12.

A number of schools I have met with this year are also thinking along these lines. The key issue to teacher preparedness and need for well considered user guidelines.

It's not difficult to see the advantages of the iPad with 12,000 education apps and counting, many text books now available as either eBooks or pdf, new initiatives such as Collusion<https://collusionapp.com/> being invented to aide collaborative work and annotations and the list goes on and on ...

The really interesting factor is the decreasing price of Andriod tablets and the inevitable growth in that market (check this<http://phandroid.com/2012/05/13/thai-govt-signs-32-8-million-deal-to-purchase-android-tablets-for-education/> article about $81 Android tablets in Thailand) - how will Apple compete?

Ta

Tim Kitchen

On 05/09/2012, at 10:47 PM, Kevork Krozian wrote:

Hi Folks,

A typo below. Unanimous choice for learning, studying and interacting by
the Yr 12s was the laptop/MacBook. None favoured the iPad.

Kevork Krozian
Edulists Creator Administrator
www.edulists.com.au<http://www.edulists.com.au>
tel: 0419 356 034<tel:0419%20356%20034>

-----Original Message-----
From: elearning-bounces at edulists.com.au<mailto:elearning-bounces at edulists.com.au>
[mailto:elearning-bounces at edulists.com.au<mailto:elearning-bounces at edulists.com.au>] On Behalf Of Kevork Krozian
Sent: Wednesday, 5 September 2012 6:43 PM
To: elearning Teachers' Mailing List
Subject: Re: [elearning] Query on iPad research

Hi Tim,

A great discussion indeed, and thanks to all the contributors.

Yes, the ancient Tablets did lead to the scrolls, that eventually led to
the iPad :)

I absolutely agree about mobile digital interactive devices including
BYODs. They are here. The hard part is how can we make the best use them.

I actually spoke to my Yr 12 SofDev class who have had Macbooks since Yr 9,
and additionally iPads since Term 2 this year . I asked which device allowed
them to learn, study, interact better. The unanimous response was iPads.
I also asked which device they would use if they were forced to choose one.
You can guess the answer. There were no iPad fans because they can't do much
with it relative to the laptops. Perhaps they are getting old ....

 The question does come back to are any schools using iPads at Yr 7 - 12
and if so how are they delivering the curriculum with iPads at the higher
levels ?

Kindest Regards

Kevork

This has been a fascinating discussion, thank you Kevork for
initiating it.

I tend to agree with Brett's thoughts on the inevitability of small
mobile devices dominating the learning environment.

When discussing the possibility of a BYOD approach for our senior
students, one of our Science staff wanted to see quantitative data
from a control group study with one class doing BYOD & another not.
The practicalities of such a study and the potential flack from
students & parents gave me some new grey hairs just thinking about it.

The quantitative & qualitative data we have gathered from student &
staff who have been part of our Year 9 iPad program this year has been
interesting. The general trend is that the distraction factor (access
to games & messages) is initially huge but, with good class management
guidelines and the developing maturity of students at this age, the
education benefits outweigh the disadvantages.

BTW, I still appreciate the ancient technology of scrolls - data from
scrolls has remained unchanged for thousands of years, how long does a
hard disk last?

Also

Wasn't the original ancient Torah based on a couple of Tablets???

Ta

Tim Kitchen
Strathcona BGGS

On 05/09/2012, at 3:31 PM, Groves, Brett G wrote:

That was a great response Ken, very thought provoking! I'm off to
research the Hawthorne effect now! (As opposed to the Collingwood
effect where one suffers from unrealistic optimism :))

Perhaps something that has been overlooked in this discussion, rather
than relatively narrow measures of academic progress, is the affect on
engagement and retention. I picked up one of my old Biology text books
recently in a bookshelf clear out and was stunned by the lack of
graphics and colour and the predominance of huge chunks of text. My
immediate thought was how did I ever learn from this? I suspect this
may well be analogous to what students from a digital generation feel
when we ask them to use books as the primary  learning resource.

My greatest concern, and believe me there are days when I'm not a fan
of 1:1, is that without reflecting what is occurring in the wider
world school will simply lose its relevance to  adolescents completely
at home with digital devices irrespective of whether we can
demonstrate specific and measurable learning improvement. In some ways
that broader imperative over arches the initial question. So rather
than asking 'can we show a learning improvement by investing in those
devices' it perhaps should be 'what can we do with the inevitable
reality of these devices to maximise learning improvement.'

A little like arguing the relative utility of scrolls compared to a
codex, it's irrelevant since the world has moved on from scrolls no
matter what advantages over a book they may have been perceived to have
enjoyed.

My 2 cents anyhow

Kind Regards,

Brett Groves
ICT Manager
Croydon Maroondah College
Croydon Campus

From:
elearning-bounces at edulists.com.au<mailto:elearning-bounces at edulists.com.au><mailto:elearning-bounces at edulists.co<mailto:elearning-bounces at edulists.co>
m.au> [mailto:elearning-bounces at edulists.com.au<mailto:elearning-bounces at edulists.com.au>]On Behalf Of ken price
Sent: Wednesday, 5 September 2012 10:22 AM
To: elearning Teachers' Mailing List
Subject: Re: [elearning] Query on iPad research ....

Hi Kevork - a very interesting topic.

For a range of reasons it is not common for a pure experimental model
(treatment and control group etc) to be used in educational settings.
Plus, for almost anything involving new technology and students there
is a massive Hawthorne effect - in broad terms students (and teachers)
feel appreciated because they have been given some new toy and some
other students haven't, and this affects their responses. Much of the
derived effects have to be obtained from data obtained in real
classrooms (with all the extraneous variables that involves) by
removing other variables statistically. It's messy.

On top of this there is another question that needs to be considered
(in my view anyway). As well as investigating "does this approach
work?" we also need to consider "does this approach produce better
outcomes than spending the equivalent amount in some other way?" ie an
opportunity cost approach.

The question is not as simple as it looks. For example, a school could
invest $1 000 000 a year in ICT or instead hire about 17 MORE teachers.
Which would produce the best outcome? Could you convince your school
of this?

The really interesting part is when you look at one of the approaches
used in some Chicago and Washington(DC) public schools, where a
different way to use the money was tried. It was, simply, to pay money
directly to students based on their educational performance, the
so-called "pay for grades" scheme. Improve your results, get extra
money - waste your time, get nothing.  In some (but not all) settings
this has worked remarkably well.
Seehttp://abcnews.go.com/GMA/Parenting/story?id=6371073&page=1<http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/Parenting/story?id=6371073&page=1>
andhttp://abcnews.go.com/Business/story?id=5635010&page=1<http://abcnews.go.com/Business/story?id=5635010&page=1>
andhttp://www.cps.edu/News/Press_releases/2008/Pages/09_11_2008_PR1.as<http://www.cps.edu/News/Press_releases/2008/Pages/09_11_2008_PR1.as>
px

Despite our personal views on the ethics of paying students to
achieve, if we are talking about a significant investment in something
like ICT and claiming it is an efficient way to improve learning, we
need to be able to argue why it is better than (say) a "pay for
grades" scheme. At some stage decisions like this fall into the hands
of beancounters and (to be fair to
them) they want to invest money in the best way.

Your other questions re what actual learning takes place is also very
worthwhile, and is the sort of thing that invites personal experiences
from teachers to build an overall picture (rather than a traditional
research model)

Thanks for raising these important areas of discussion,

Ken
On Wed, Sep 5, 2012 at 8:13 AM, Kevork Krozian
<kevork at edulists.com.au<mailto:kevork at edulists.com.au><mailto:kevork at edulists.com.au<mailto:kevork at edulists.com.au>>> wrote:
Hi Folks,

Really interesting discussion. You make a great point Ziad.

The barometer I guess for many years has been John Hattie with his
extensive work on "effect size" with 2 groups holding everything else
as constant as possible except the one difference.
Quoting : The most prominent meta-meta-analyst in education is
probablyJohn
Hattie<http://www.education.auckland.ac.nz/uoa/home/about/staff/j.hatt
ie>, whose work draws on "a total of about 800 meta-analyses, which
encompassed
52,637 studies, and provided 146,142 effect sizes [...] these studies
are based on many millions of students" (Hattie, 2009; 15)
-http://www.learningandteaching.info/teaching/what_works.htm

Actually I recently compiled a long list of resources trying to
separate digitization from eLearning - see
http://delicious.com/kkrozian

I would be interested to hear further about what learning actually
takes place rather than what application is used. The paper mentioned
by Trudy is really worthwhile and I recommend people have a look at it
as it does try to balance all the views.

I would also be very interested to hear from schools who have gone
iPad 7 - 12 and how they have managed delivery of those studies that
require more than what iPads have delivered to date such as VCE IT,
media and existing web based flash based resources such as in LOTE,
Maths, that have not been upgraded to date.
Are any schools using remote desktop from the student iPads to teach
any of these classes ?

Kind Regards

Kevork Krozian
Edulists Creator Administrator
www.edulists.com.au<http://www.edulists.com.au><http://www.edulists.com.au>
tel: 0419 356 034<tel:0419%20356%20034>

From:
elearning-bounces at edulists.com.au<mailto:elearning-bounces at edulists.com.au><mailto:elearning-bounces at edulists.co<mailto:elearning-bounces at edulists.co>
m.au>
[mailto:elearning-bounces at edulists.com.au<mailto:elearning-bounces at edulists.com.au><mailto:elearning-bounces at edu<mailto:elearning-bounces at edu>
lists.com.au<http://lists.com.au>>]On
Behalf Of Ziad Baroudi
Sent: Tuesday, 4 September 2012 10:51 PM

To: elearning Teachers' Mailing List
Subject: Re: [elearning] Query on iPad research ....

Many argue that validity in the sense used by scientists cannot exist
in most areas of educational research. I once read something written
by Seymour Papert in which he says that something such as  "using a
computer"

is not a single variable we can study while keeping all else constant.
The whole point of using a computer is that it changes everything.

Even when iPads have been around for a long time and meta-research is
available on their "effect", we will be looking at an average
"effective size" that brings together all kinds of different uses of
the device. Two studies, one hugely successful and one hugely
unsuccessful, may result in an average effect size that is close to
zero. It would be more useful to look into the details of the
successful study to see what practices we can adopt.

Sincerely,
Ziad.
On 4 September 2012 21:33, Hutchison, Geoffrey G
<hutchison.geoffrey.g at edumail.vic.gov.au<mailto:hutchison.geoffrey.g at edumail.vic.gov.au><mailto:hutchison.geoffrey.g at e<mailto:hutchison.geoffrey.g at e>
dumail.vic.gov.au<http://dumail.vic.gov.au>>>
wrote:
Good luck Kevork on finding valid education research. Very little is
valid in the sense that double blind trials are almost non-existent
and the use of control groups rare.

Virtually all education research is anecdotal in terms of evidence,
and thus invalid in terms of true research.

Geoff Hutchison,
McGuire College

On 4/09/12 6:24 PM, "Kevork Krozian"
<kevork at edulists.com.au<mailto:kevork at edulists.com.au><mailto:kevork at edulists.com.au<mailto:kevork at edulists.com.au>>> wrote:
Hi Folks,

  If I may ask a very broad question, is anyone across recent
research covering the impact of iPads and apps in learning
achievement/improvement at any level ( primary, secondary, tertiary ) ?

Specifically, I am wondering if there is a control group of any type
such as alternate tablets, mobile devices,  netbooks, MacBook Air,
MacBook Pro etc etc.

Additionally I am wondering if a baseline is used in the study such as "
Both groups, control and iPad users entered the study at VELS level x.
At
the end of the study the control group was at y and the iPad users
were at z on the VELS or any other measurement used".

Generalized findings such as students showed improvement in
confidence with the use of technology or could read better ( than
what ? not having any technology or having a laptop or working in
labs ? ) will not be as useful IMHO.

It is a topic that has come up in discussion and I am looking for
both research as well as anecdotal evidence from schools on the iPad
journey if I may please.

Kind Regards
Kevork

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eLearning Mailing List kindly supported by
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eLearning Mailing List kindly supported by
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Dr Tim Kitchen
Director of Learning Technologies
Strathcona Baptist Girls Grammar School
http://timkitchen.net

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