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<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>A very good morning to you all,</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2> I hope your first week was a reasonable one
and there wasn't too much grief grappling with changes - we went from a 6 to a 4
period day , and I have 5 classes, 4 new ( 3 with new study designs, one not
taught before ) so it is a brisk pace at present.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2> Back to the issue with requesting assistance
raised by John.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2> There does not come a time when all of us at
some point , do not need assistance. I asked for help on VB.NET 18 months
ago as I had a need ( blind student in my class could not use Java ) and
modified what I found to suit my class. </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2><BR>This year I asked for help on Gamemaker as I am
teaching a Year 8 IT class for the first time and have to see what level tasks
are at. To prepare a set of tasks and then revise them or throw them out after
submitting it to the list for feedback seems a tortuous path to take. I have
worked with colleagues who have taken a similar attitude when asked for
assistance, with comments like " now I want to see how much of this you do
on your own before I will consider helping you ...." to which I have replied in
the past with " thanks but no thanks and you may need me one day and I will take
the same attitude that you have shown " but with more colourful language than
this quote. Needless to say everyone suffered with that approach - me, him and
our students.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>It is very rare to be able to receive something
from the lists and immediately hand it to the students in exactly the same form
. We always have to adjust, adapt, improve, dumb down, make more rigorous or do
a number of other adjustments before it fits our cohort. One size rarely fits
all.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Another example was a request for a timeline a
week ago, for Software Development with the Fitzpatrick and Keane
textbook. It took me about 4 hours to prepare mine. Another teacher asked for it
and I gladly handed it over and posted it on the web site for others to use.
What is the point of multiplying the work of 4 hours times two or three hundred
teachers ????? I am sure one or more of them would also offer some other work I
would need in future that would save me a comparable amount of
time.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>The key is to make sure we keep giving feedback and
helping the contributor with their development as well by running
a professional eye over the work and communicating our view of it back to
them for further refinement. That is the point Adrian made. He would love
feedback as it would help me be a better teacher. </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>In conclusion, John has expressed an opinion that
the majority of us do not agree with, some more forcefully than others. But,
that is the point of these lists, to express a view, inform, clarify and argue -
as long as we keep to the rules. So Maggie, we do love you dearly but
your email was a little , let's say, not becoming of the professional esteem in
which we all hold you .... !!!</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>I hope we all keep sharing , and especially the new
or younger or less experienced teachers. Please, please, please do not hesitate
to ask for help. We will all be the better for it.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Vive la difference !!!</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>I also welcome feedback as I hope that will make me
a better Mailing List Administrator .</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT><FONT
face=Arial size=2></FONT><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT><FONT face=Arial
size=2></FONT><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Best wishes to you all with your classes in
2007</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><BR>Kevork Krozian<BR>Mailing List Creator and Administrator<BR><A
href="mailto:kevork@edulists.com.au">kevork@edulists.com.au</A><BR><A
href="http://www.edulists.com.au">www.edulists.com.au</A><BR>Tel: 0419 356
034</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE
style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
<DIV
style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: black"><B>From:</B>
<A title=cjjansen@gmail.com href="mailto:cjjansen@gmail.com">Christopher
Jansen</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A title=yr7-10it@edulists.com.au
href="mailto:yr7-10it@edulists.com.au">Year 7 - 10 Information Technology
Teachers' Mailing List</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Saturday, February 03, 2007 2:58
AM</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: [Yr7-10it] IPM2007
assistance</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV>Maybe he was just being the devils advocate to get people fired up so he
would get more emails in his inbox sort through.... ha ha</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>I'm not sure he achieved what he really wanted, that being less emails..
ha ha ha bad luck John. BTW all us experienced ITers have set up a rule in our
email inbox to divert these emails to a place so that they don't clog up our
inbox and we can sift through them at a nicer time. ie. not after
holidays. </DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>Maybe what we could post is a"how to" on setting up a rule in
different email applications</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>thanks heaps all, </DIV>
<DIV>Go sharing of ideas.. <BR><BR> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=gmail_quote>On 2/2/07, <B class=gmail_sendername>Adrian
Janson</B> <<A
href="mailto:jansona@bigpond.net.au">jansona@bigpond.net.au</A>>
wrote:</SPAN>
<BLOCKQUOTE class=gmail_quote
style="PADDING-LEFT: 1ex; MARGIN: 0px 0px 0px 0.8ex; BORDER-LEFT: #ccc 1px solid">Adding
my voice to the chorus.... !!<BR><BR>Enough has probably been said, however,
there are a few important things to <BR>consider.<BR><BR>Firstly, these
lists exist for this very purpose - so please if you need<BR>resources, put
a request out there and those of us who have them are usually<BR>very happy
to post them for all to make use of as they wish. <BR><BR>Secondly, I still
remember what it is like as a first year out teacher - you<BR>have very few
resources to draw on and often you are the only IT teacher in<BR>your
school. This is the sort of networking that VCAA (especially)
really <BR>wants us to be doing, to ensure that courses are delivered in the
right way<BR>and criteria are followed.<BR><BR>So please - don't hesitate to
post a request for assistance! ... and on the<BR>flip side of
that coin - don't be shy about posting your own material to the
<BR>lists. There are some of us that post a lot, but many of us
who don't.<BR>Don't feel that you will be judged - because you
won't. Every contribution<BR>enriches the whole
experience..... When I post documents, I write something <BR>like
'here is (such and such).... feel free to modify it or let me know
what<BR>you think!'.... I really feel that if 1 person finds any
of my material<BR>useful, then I have done a good deed - and those that
can't use it, don't. <BR><BR>Cheers,<BR>Adrian Janson<BR>VITTA
President<BR>Director of ICT, Melbourne High School<BR><BR><BR>-----Original
Message-----<BR>From: <A
href="mailto:yr7-10it-bounces@edulists.com.au">yr7-10it-bounces@edulists.com.au
</A><BR>[mailto:<A
href="mailto:yr7-10it-bounces@edulists.com.au">yr7-10it-bounces@edulists.com.au</A>]
On Behalf Of Geoff Moss<BR>Sent: Friday, 2 February 2007 11:31 PM<BR>To:
Year 7 - 10 Information Technology Teachers' Mailing List <BR>Subject: Re:
[Yr7-10it] IPM2007
assistance<BR><BR>Hear!! Hear!! Keith, Therese,
Maggie.<BR><BR>Haven't we all at some time copied or borrowed ideas and
materials from<BR>others? Then we have modified it and made it
suit our students or purposes. <BR><BR>Didn't we borrow ideas of our mentors
on teaching rounds and in our early<BR>years of teaching.<BR><BR>Heaven bid,
isn't a textbook the work and ideas of someone else who has
been<BR><BR>prepared to distribute their ideas for others to use and share.
<BR><BR>John, I assume that you therefore don't use a textbook, refer to or
use<BR>resources on this mailing list and the VITTA website, or use or
modify ideas<BR><BR>presented and distributed at conferences,
etc. Also I assume you do not use <BR><BR>such references as Mark
Kelly's website, wikipedia and howstuffworks.<BR><BR>We all do it and it is
not the right or privilege of "experienced" teachers<BR>to copy ideas and
materials from others. We are learners and and learning,
<BR>sharing ideas, materials and resources for the common good of our
students<BR>and to encourage and develop the skills of fellow
teachers.<BR><BR>We are so lucky that there are a few teachers (I wont
mention names lest I <BR>leave out someone) on the mailing list who are
continually prepared to<BR>contribute and share their ideas more than most
of the rest of us, for which<BR><BR>the majority are truly
grateful.<BR><BR>Thanks to the mailing list and its many contributors and
the authors of our <BR>textbooks over the years I, for one, am better
prepared and more able to<BR>deliver the ITA, and former IPM, courses
without having to go back and<BR>reinvent the wheel. I have been
able to provide a wider range of<BR>stimulating materials to my classes than
I would have done on my own.<BR><BR>I am also one who has not contributed as
much as many others, however, I am<BR>sure the many contributors don't think
any less of me and others in this <BR>category, ([Though we should
contribute when we can) because they all share<BR>for the common good of
providing for the the eduction of all students, not<BR>just their
own.<BR><BR>So Vinod, and any other first year IT teachers, welcome to the
list and we <BR>encourage you to keep seeking assistance from fellow
colleagues and may you<BR>have success with your class during the
year.<BR><BR>Geoff Moss<BR>RMIT<BR><BR>----- Original Message -----<BR>From:
"Keith Richardson" < <A
href="mailto:keithcr@fastmail.fm">keithcr@fastmail.fm</A>><BR>To: "Year 7
- 10 Information Technology Teachers' Mailing List"<BR><<A
href="mailto:yr7-10it@edulists.com.au">yr7-10it@edulists.com.au</A>
><BR>Sent: Friday, February 02, 2007 9:39 PM<BR>Subject: RE: [Yr7-10it]
IPM2007 assistance<BR><BR><BR>> John - shame! What is wrong with people
"using" the ideas of others? I<BR>> do it all of the time, and learn
heaps from it. <BR>> The big risk of negative comments like yours is it
can "scare off" timid<BR>> teachers who are not wanting to offend, but
want to professionally<BR>> provide the best possible for their
students.<BR>> My self confidence over the years has grown from receiving
the<BR>> unconditional support of others, and I then feel freed (by this)
to<BR>> offer my help whenever it is sought.<BR>> Everyone - seek and
you shall find. Remain silent and you will remain <BR>> lost. Do not be
intimidated by negative comments.<BR>>
Keith.<BR>><BR>><BR>><BR>><BR>> On Fri, 2 Feb 2007 20:59:26
+1100, "Therese Keane"<BR>> <<A
href="mailto:Therese.Keane@genazzano.vic.edu.au">
Therese.Keane@genazzano.vic.edu.au</A>> said:<BR>>> I have to
disagree with your comments John.<BR>>><BR>>> Given only this
week, it was reported in the media that large numbers of<BR>>> new
teachers do not "hang around" in the teaching profession past 5 <BR>>>
years. This in itself should ring alarm bells.<BR>>><BR>>>
Firstly, I have no problems in helping first year teachers with using
my<BR>>> materials. Over the years, I (like many other people,
including Maggie!) <BR>>> ran sessions on behalf of VITTA where I
freely gave away my materials. I<BR>>> did not mind that teachers used
them in their own classes. All teachers<BR>>> no matter how many years
of experience need help, support and <BR>>> assistance. Like many
other people in the IT community, I am not alone<BR>>> in the sharing
of resources.<BR>>><BR>>> After all, why have a list at all if
people do not want to share ideas<BR>>> or resources? This is
recognised by VITTA who have just produced a CD<BR>>> full of
resources. I strongly believe that anyone has the right to ask<BR>>>
for assistance and should not be made to feel intimidated by comments
<BR>>> like yours.<BR>>><BR>>> With respect to Information
Technology Applications it is often the case<BR>>> that there is only
1 teacher in the school and so they need support from<BR>>> the
broader IT community, especially if they are a first timer. Please
<BR>>> treat first timers with the same amount of support that you
would expect<BR>>> if you were in their
position.<BR>>><BR>>> Therese<BR>>><BR>>>
-----Original Message-----<BR>>> From: <A
href="mailto:yr7-10it-bounces@edulists.com.au">yr7-10it-bounces@edulists.com.au</A><BR>>>
[mailto:<A
href="mailto:yr7-10it-bounces@edulists.com.au">yr7-10it-bounces@edulists.com.au</A>]
On Behalf Of<BR>>> <A
href="mailto:iaquinto@ozemail.com.au">iaquinto@ozemail.com.au</A><BR>>>
Sent: Friday, 2 February 2007 7:57 PM<BR>>> To: <A
href="mailto:yr7-10it@edulists.com.au">yr7-10it@edulists.com.au</A><BR>>>
Subject: RE: [Yr7-10it] IPM2007 assistance<BR>>><BR>>> Thanks
for your comments, John. I'm afraid I must let you know that you<BR>>>
have made these comments on the wrong list. Yeps. Please subscribe
to<BR>>> the curmudgeon list and you will find sentiments similar to
yours. <BR>>><BR>>> Maggie<BR>>><BR>>> Quoting John
Torey <<A
href="mailto:jtorey@parade.vic.edu.au">jtorey@parade.vic.edu.au</A>>:<BR>>><BR>>>
> Dear IPMers,<BR>>> ><BR>>> > I know this is late but
I have over 100 emails still to sort through <BR>>> > from over the
break, but seriously, this process of just asking for<BR>>> > work
to look at is just a polite attempt to gain work in order to<BR>>>
> minimise the amount of work to do.<BR>>> ><BR>>> > If
people are qualified to teach IT then they should be able to
write<BR>>> > it themselves and then use the appropriate IT list (
not this one for<BR>>> > IPM but use the IPM list) to show it and
let the experienced Iters <BR>>> > look at at it and respond if it
looks good.<BR>>> ><BR>>> > First timers should stop
trying to get the work for nothing.<BR>>> ><BR>>> > Lets
get real and encourage first timers to do the work and not copy <BR>>>
> work.<BR>>> ><BR>>> > Cheers,<BR>>>
><BR>>> > John Torey<BR>>> > Mathematics Convenor
(taught IT/IPM between 1992 - 2003) Parade<BR>>> > College -
Bundoora VIC <BR>>> > (03) 9468 3300<BR>>> > <A
href="mailto:jtorey@parade.vic.edu.au">jtorey@parade.vic.edu.au</A><BR>>>
><BR>>> ><BR>>> > -----Original
Message-----<BR>>> > From: <A
href="mailto:yr7-10it-bounces@edulists.com.au">yr7-10it-bounces@edulists.com.au</A><BR>>>
> [mailto:<A
href="mailto:yr7-10it-bounces@edulists.com.au">yr7-10it-bounces@edulists.com.au</A>]
On Behalf Of<BR>>> > <A
href="mailto:narayanv@yeahs.vic.edu.au">narayanv@yeahs.vic.edu.au</A><BR>>>
> Sent: Friday, 15 December 2006 8:35 AM<BR>>> > To: <A
href="mailto:yr7-10it@edulists.com.au">yr7-10it@edulists.com.au</A><BR>>>
> Subject: [Yr7-10it] IPM2007 assistance<BR>>> ><BR>>>
> Hi Keith<BR>>> > I will be teaching IPM 3 & 4 in 2007 for
the first time. If you have<BR>>> > done any planning based on the
text below, I would be pleased to have <BR>>> > a look at it to
assist me teaching IPM next year.<BR>>> > It would be of great
help.<BR>>> > I would be also be too happy to receive work set for
outcomes 1 and 2.<BR>>> > Your assistance will be greatly
appreciated. <BR>>> > Thank you.<BR>>> > Vinod
Narayan<BR>>> > Yea High School.<BR>>> ><BR>>> >
"Information Technology Applications VCE Units 3 & 4 - EDITION: 2
-<BR>>> >> ISBN: 0170130258 <BR>>> >> AUTHORS: Colin
Potts, Therese Keane, Janet Lancaster, James Lawson,<BR>>> >>
Margaret Lawson"<BR>>> ><BR>>> ><BR>>> > "Keith
Richardson" <<A href="mailto:keithcr@fastmail.fm">
keithcr@fastmail.fm</A>> on Wed, 22 Nov 2006 21:42:38<BR>>> >
+1100 wrote:<BR>>> >> Does anyone have proofs of this book for
next year?<BR>>> >><BR>>> >> "Information Technology
Applications VCE Units 3 & 4 - EDITION: 2 - <BR>>> >> ISBN:
0170130258<BR>>> >> AUTHORS: Colin Potts, Therese Keane, Janet
Lancaster, James Lawson,<BR>>> >> Margaret Lawson"<BR>>>
>><BR>>> >> REASON - I want to do my detailed planning
now, and will be happy to <BR>>> >> share it with others through
this list.<BR>>> >><BR>>> >> Cheers,
Keith<BR>>> >> Keith Richardson<BR>>> >> IPM List
Moderator<BR>>> >> Head of ICT, Leibler Yavneh College
<BR>>> >> Elsternwick<BR>>> >> Ph:
03.9528.4911<BR>>> >> <A
href="mailto:k.richardson@yavneh.vic.edu.au">k.richardson@yavneh.vic.edu.au</A><BR>>>
>><BR>>> >>
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href="http://www.vcaa.vic.edu.au">http://www.vcaa.vic.edu.au </A>- Victorian
Curriculum and Assessment Authority and <BR><A
href="http://www.vitta.org.au">http://www.vitta.org.au </A>- VITTA Victorian
Information Technology Teachers Association Inc</BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>