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<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>Hi all,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>An interesting and informative session today.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>I’m still confused as to where the term “complex”
fits in as part of a solution. Shouldn’t it be efficient, effective and
appropriate? We could make anything more complex but why should marks be
awarded for something that is totally artificial such as sorting arrays of 16
items? Perhaps this would have been better approached as a key skill in Outcome
1. If you teach students how to code a “complex” sorting algorithm
and the complexity, I’m guessing refers to how complex it is to code,
then won’t each student use the same approach as I certainly wouldn’t
expect them to reinvent the wheel and the tyre?<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>We are asked to use features of an OO language so where do we
draw the line?<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>There is also the question of data structures and complexity.
Does a C# Dictionary count as a complex data structure? They are pretty much O(1)
for searching and far easier to use than arrays in many instances.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>Regards<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>Brett Fitzsimmons<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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<div style='border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm 0cm 0cm'>
<p class=MsoNormal><b><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:
"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>From:</span></b><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'> sofdev-bounces@edulists.com.au
[mailto:sofdev-bounces@edulists.com.au] <b>On Behalf Of </b>Croke, Daryl D<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Monday, June 20, 2016 10:07 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Year 12 Software Development Teachers' Mailing List<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Year 12 SofDev] sorting criteria My thoughts<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif";
color:black'>Hi all<br>
<br>
<i>Andrew</i><br>
"I used Hungarian dances to teach sorting", I thought WTF then i
found this great playlist on youtube<br>
<br>
<a
href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EdIKIf9mHk0&list=PLOmdoKois7_FK-ySGwHBkltzB11snW7KQ"
target="_blank">https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EdIKIf9mHk0&list=PLOmdoKois7_FK-ySGwHBkltzB11snW7KQ</a><br>
<br>
<i>Andrew</i><br>
"The young people found that for most of them the actual getting up and
moving around was a good idea"<br>
<br>
I will try this in Craigieburn it could be bravest thing I've done since
getting students at Preston Girls to act out a While Loop :) <o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif";color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";color:black'>Cheers<br>
<br>
Daryl Croke<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";
color:black'><br>
Mount Ridley College<br>
8338 3600<br>
<a href="http://mountridleycollege.vic.edu.au/">http://mountridleycollege.vic.edu.au/</a><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
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<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";
color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><b><i><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";
color:black'>keep on coding</span></i></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><i><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";
color:black'><a href="http://geekstuff.global2.vic.edu.au/">http://geekstuff.global2.vic.edu.au/</a><br>
<a href="http://physicalcomputing.global2.vic.edu.au/">http://physicalcomputing.global2.vic.edu.au/</a></span></i><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";
color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";
color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
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<div>
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style='color:black'>
<hr size=2 width="100%" align=center>
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<div id=divRpF300778>
<p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";color:black'>From:</span></b><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";color:black'>
sofdev-bounces@edulists.com.au [sofdev-bounces@edulists.com.au] on behalf of
Andrew Shortell [shortell@get2me.net]<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Monday, 20 June 2016 5:26 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Year 12 Software Development Teachers' Mailing List<br>
<b>Subject:</b> [Year 12 SofDev] sorting criteria My thoughts</span><span
style='color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:black'>Hi All <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:black'>been thinking a lot about
today’s PD at coburg<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:black'>our table discussed the below -
are we too harsh, too easy, or in the goldilocks zone?<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:black'>in the criteria the students have
to document and use a complex sort to obtain a 9 or 10<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:black'>so the documentation can be the
internal doc because very few companies produce a “Tech Ref Guide”
they just put stuff on their website and let google etc find it<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:black'>so what is a complex sort<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:black'>perhaps start at the other
end <o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:black'>to get 1 or 2 they should be able
to use the built in sort function (properly and put internal doc about it)<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:black'>to get 3 or 4 maybe a bubble
sort (I taught it because it is so simple and not too hard to get them to
understand it)<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:black'>to get 5 or 6 maybe a selection
sort - documented<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:black'>to get 7 or 8 a quick sort<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:black'>to get 9 or 10 they need to
display deeper knowledge<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:black'>such as a quick sort is NOT
efficient when the sublist size drops below about fifteen so at that point need
to do selection (or insertion) sort<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:black'>in visual studio the sort method
uses quick-sort to a sublist of 16 then selection sort according to MSDN<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:black'>So the sort method in VB is very
complex — but using it is so simple<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:black'>but I want to see that they can
code …<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:black'>I used Hungarian dances to teach
sorting - even getting students on their feet and “dancing” around
( I cannot remember for sure who found them on youtube originally [was it
Mystery Mark? ] but thanks)<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:black'>The young people found that for
most of them the actual getting up and moving around was a good idea<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:black'>It is also a great way to teach
linked lists - not a lot of dancing but my students realised how little
movement there is in a linked list!<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:black'>more thoughts as they surface<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:black'>Andrew<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";
color:black'><br>
Andrew Shortell<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";
color:black'>Educator<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";
color:black'>CRC Melton<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";
color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";
color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";
color:black'><a
href="redir.aspx?REF=16_hgPM4hV12-RPj-vCKD6EJlfNOthQQ2teclkGfp1nUrCi-ApnTCAFtYWlsdG86c2hvcnRlbGxAZ2V0Mm1lLm5ldA.."
target="_blank">shortell@get2me.net</a> (This List)<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";
color:black'>@acsbear8 (twitter)<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
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<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";
color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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