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</o:shapelayout></xml><![endif]--></head><body lang=EN-AU link=blue vlink=purple><div class=WordSection1><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Michael<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>I am willing to give it a try but am concerned about the store of great stuff in the archives of the current list and that the group not become split into two groups. I’m afraid it has to be all or nothing to be truly useful. Kevork’s list has set a very high standard which will be difficult to match.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>John Schwartz<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Semi-retired<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>From:</span></b><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'> itapps-bounces@edulists.com.au [mailto:itapps-bounces@edulists.com.au] <b>On Behalf Of </b>Mark<br><b>Sent:</b> Monday, 24 November 2014 3:36 PM<br><b>To:</b> Year 12 IT Applications Teachers' Mailing List<br><b>Subject:</b> Re: [Year 12 IT Apps] NEW Google+ Community for ITA Teachers<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal>Hi Michael. I understand your logic perfectly, and I have also - in other online arenas - created <i>fantastically</i> sensible and <i>logical</i> and <i>brilliantly</i> functional new forums for discussion... which <i>never</i> succeeded.<o:p></o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>A community is not its technology. It's the people, and convincing a group of contented people to make a major shift is always a big ask - even if the rewards are manifold and clear.<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>I think even Kevork would acknowledge the technical constraints of the Edulists platform, but we all would acknowledge the authority, comfort, reliability, familiarity and service that his lists have deservedly accumulated over many years of faithful service.<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>The spouse might be getting a bit wrinkled, tubby in the middle, and hard to get out of the car at times, but you still love the dear thing and enjoy playing bingo together on Fridays. You don't dump said spouse by the roadside when a shiny new forum rolls up and invites you to get in. Even if it's <i>really</i> sexy.<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>(Sorry Kevork, That analogy got a bit lost... Your Edulists are certainly <i>not</i> tubby.)<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>No technology is perfect, but it will be just as hard to get Edulist people to move platforms as it is to dislodge a snug and happy cat off your lap.<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>History shows that without a manifestly and unarguably superior argument, proposals to split <i>any</i> forum tend to stagnate and fail. <o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>Why else do Yahoo Groups and the QWERTY keyboard still exist? <o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>As a former long-time admin at alt.config - which tried to regulate the creation of new alt.* Usenet groups - I can attest to the old wisdom: if you want to split, you need the permission of the community... or sufficiently distinguish your new group from the old one to justify its existence. Mere duplication of the existing group is not enough - most regulars are perfectly happy where they are. <o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>Like most divorces, successful splits usually follow protracted arguments and complaints about the status quo. And even then, the complainers choose to persist for a while in their misery.<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>'Cos change is scary.<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>Again, Michael, I fully understand your motivation, and welcome your initiative. Let's see how it goes. <o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>Build the new community. Prove its benefits to the herd.<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>Of course if you could bring Kevork with you, the whole issue would be settled by tomorrow... we faithful hounds follow our master.<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>Woof !<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>Regards<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>Mark<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal>On 24 November 2014 at 12:16, Poke, Michael C <<a href="mailto:poke.michael.c@edumail.vic.gov.au" target="_blank">poke.michael.c@edumail.vic.gov.au</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal>Hi all,<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>While I enjoy this mailing list, I strongly believe that as IT teachers we could be better served by taking our conversations to a more modern and user friendly medium. After all, isn’t that what we teach our students to do? For this reason, I’ve created a Google+ Community specifically for us ITA teachers. If you are unaware, Google+ is an amazing place for finding and connecting to vibrant, relevant communities about your interests and pursuits. Where Google+ fails as a social networking site, it succeeds in creating energetic, well utilised ‘Communities’. <o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><b>You can find your new ITA Teachers’ Community at: </b><a href="https://plus.google.com/u/0/communities/104249627663280730813" target="_blank">https://plus.google.com/u/0/communities/104249627663280730813</a><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>I look forward to connecting with you there.<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>Cheers,<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>Michael Poke<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>Manor Lakes P-12 College<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div></div></div><p class=MsoNormal>-- <o:p></o:p></p><div><div><div><div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>Mark Kelly<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>mark AT vceit DOT com<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><a href="http://vceit.com" target="_blank">http://vceit.com</a><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><i>I enjoy non-sequiturs because... cows.</i><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><div><p class=MsoNormal>I, Mark Kelly, am entirely responsible for the rambling verbiage I spew forth.<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>I'm not sure whom I have offended with this post. Cats, cows, canines, Kevork?<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>If offended, please whinge to me at the email address above. <o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>Please leave poor Kevork alone. It is not his fault.<o:p></o:p></p></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></body></html>